Could Thomas Wayne have forced Penny to sign fake adoption papers to cover up the child born out of wedlock? It might all be a lie and that he accepted the abuse claim since he got tired of her.2.) To make matters worse, he looked like he was genuinely enjoying himself before they stole his sign, not just faking a good mood for the job. Todd revealed, that he tried to convince Joaquin several times, before Joaquin accepted the role. Archived post. And he was flawless, composed and methodical. They would have arrested him regardless of whether they believed him or not. Also worth noting despite initially claiming to like Arthur, his boss clearly doesn't with the sign incident having him be prebiased against anything what Arthur says because he is inherently untrustworthy as a mental patient, not even Arthur's heavy bruises seemed to convince him. Interpreting non-statistically significant results: Do we have "no evidence" or "insufficient evidence" to reject the null. And the cinema appears to be an 'upmarket venue' showing 'First or 2nd' runs of films (Early eighties, no cell phones.) Even if he throws Randall under the bus how is the boss supposed to believe him when he tries to dodge the fault altogether on instinct because he knew he'll lose the job if he tells the truth. Can someone explain what the red footprints were at the end along the corridor and then the running about at the end of the corridor? The movie does not directly tie into Ledger's portrayal in "The Dark Knight" as it takes place in the 80s. Edit, You can see that Murray himself does little goofy dances all the time during his show and Arthur sorta seems to have taken that trait from him. A contextual clue that maybe he didn't is later, Fleck didn't murder Gary (Leigh Gill) because the little person was the only clown at his workplace who was nice to him. The last he could have allowed to live, however, yet he instead chooses to chase the man down and put five bullets in him. Also because there were no cameras and no reliable witnesses to confirm the identity of the suspect. Randall sounds genuinely sympathetic towards Arthur at first, before its discovered its merely a ruse and that he paid the visit to learn what the police know about his firearm. Answer (1 of 3): No. The first scene we see Randall, as he hands Arthur a gun, Randall has an evil smile on his face while suggesting Arthur "pays him back sometime", followed up with "you know you're my boy." which triggers Arthur's laugh. The fridge can be seen as a womb of sorts, with Arthur climbing inside taking the fetal position and emerging anew as Joker. Murray may have realized that either he was going to get lots of ratings or make television history. Arthur's mother: And did Arthur really kill his mother in hospital? He even tells Murray "if i was dead or laying down on the street, you'd walk right over me"/.That's MY two cents . Fans imagine that he was hoping that Arthur could defy the studio audience's expectations, have a successful (or even semi-sucessful) routine, and have people cheering for his bravery at taking the stage. To his horror, his conditions rears its head during a trip on the subway, where three Wall Street guys round on him and attempt to beat him to a pulp. He seemed like a jerk who liked to pick on Arthur's condition? Edit, He certainly was in Arthur Fleck's eyes. He's an unreliable narrator who has a poor relationship with his mother. Also, Murray seems to understand that Arthur isn't actually insane, It's clear that Arthur is trying to justify his crimes, and as far as Murray can tell, Arthur is pretending to be the subway murderer to gain attention. At the beginning of the film they're both shown to be good enough friends that they joke together. The point is that he threw Arthur under the bus even when he didn't need to. The entire program was cut and Arthur can't afford it on his own. Edit, There are nine confirmed deaths in the film, six of them killed by Arthur.The three Wall Street businessmen: shot to death, on the subwayRandall: stabbed in head with scissorsPenny Fleck: smothered with a pillow in the hospitalMurray Franklin: shot in the head at point blank range. Many think that the clerk in Arkham Asylum was fairly nice to Arthur, in searching for his mother's records. However there are many clues to allude that Thomas is his father, including the photo of a young penny signed "T.W." Arthur was lying in bed touching himself when the personnel from the Murray Franklin show called him at home. Sher continued, "In terms of what we did visually to play with the real and not real, there are callbacks and scenes that mirror each other. That line is important. Are there really 3 Jokers? Edit, Viewers have to consider that the lie goes deeper than just the father's identity, if that is a lie at all. Where does Arthur get the bullets for his revolver? Also, Todd did not want him in the film, because he wrote the script with Joaquin in mind. If this incident (or something like it) did in fact happen, Thomas was most likely "flying off the handle" at Arthur for having put his fingers in his son Bruce's mouth; a rather creepy violation of the child's personal space that would seriously upset any decent parent or guardian, though not necessarily to the point of provoking such a violent reaction. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. In Joker (2019), why did Randall give the Joker the gun? To make it worse, the mother possibly doesn't even care about this explanation. Penny Fleck | Batman Wiki | Fandom (Biggest opening weekend in Singapore for NC16-rated movie ever.). When the young Bruce first sees Arthur outside the wall at Wayne Manor, he slides down a pole to go to the gate. Maybe what he does could be seen as less idiotic and more heroic in that light. May as well try and see how the maniac's mind works.4.) The pacing of the movie and the character development of Arthur is almost Birdman-like. Randall, apart from generally being mean, insisted on him taking his gun. Edit. A little bit like the William Hung experience on "American Idol". How was Murray able to air the footage of Arthur's comedy act without getting a release first? Just like no one thought his comedy bits were funny but him. In the movie, Arthur Fleck's mental condition was repeatedly triggered by people of colour. 2) It's meant to be deliberately ambiguous, him being locked up for his crimes. It is difficult to argue that the casting of these characters in all these scenes was a coincidence, or that it is a shot at diversity representation. Did Sophie, who was at best cordial and smiled at Arthur in the elevator, also escape death for being "nice" to him? The exploration of Arthur Fleck (Joaquin Phoenix), a man disregarded by. They want to slowly roast Arthur with repeated visits until he either snaps or confesses. When Arthur becomes the Joker and he calls out the horrible state of things in Gotham while on the show with Murray Franklin, Arthur could very well be speaking about present day America where people can no longer seem to communicate civilly. Are those cigarettes real? That's the true end to the story. Joker cinematographer Lawrence Sher has answered the lingering question of whether Arthur Fleck killed his neighbor Sophie Dumond near the end of the blockbuster DC film. Why are they (the three men from the subway) called the Wall Street Three when Gotham is an entirely separate city from New York? Edit, It could've gone both ways really. It just seemed strange that he would not only completely turn on Arthur after the hospital fiasco (rather than coordinate with him to create a bullshit story) and then flat-out go to his apartment weeks later to try and intimidate him into silence. When Joker wakes up with a cough of blood, there's a dreamlike quality to the scene as he stands up and receives a hero's welcome for his brutal actions. He probably knew that he was gonna die either way. Joker doesnt flinch as he drives a pair of scissors into his former boss eye and proceeds to repeatedly slam his head again a wall before he bleeds out. Joker doesnt like this one bit and grabs Waynes confidant by the tie before proceeding to strangle him while a dumbstruck Bruce looks on. There are so many theories about the ending of Joker that its tough to know where to start. He explains that Gary's kindness didn't go unnoticed, which shows he doesn't murder indiscriminately. It's a form of rebirth. Using an Ohm Meter to test for bonding of a subpanel. While she cares about her son, she has shown to lie to him multiple occasions which leads to her downfall. Is it possible he has a limp due to his abuse in the past that caused him to have it? 3) His foot hurts from when he was kicking a trash bin earlier in the film Published Oct 4, 2019. The scene is harrowing as he calmly places a pillow over her face, applying pressure in order to suffocate her. Privacy policy. Whenever Arthur is walking down the streets of Gotham, why does he seems to stagger a bit on one of his legs? Edit, The comedy club probably had a disclaimer that they owned the rights to all footage taken inside the club, and authorized the use of the video. [Spoiler] Joker (2019) movie: Why did Arthur Fleck kill his - Quora Also it's possible Arthur may have decided to not bother explaining why he had the gun because he felt (possibly correctly) that nobody would listen to him anyway. This is where we need to look at Arthur's murders sequentially. Some fans might disagree with Sher, however, since Sophie's reaction to Arthur being in his apartment could be viewed as wronging Arthur. Spoilers: What Happened to Zazie Beetz in 'Joker'? Does Joker Kill Sophie? If this was the case, it would also explain why Randalls death was the most brutal and drawn out, compared to everyone else. The 3 guys in the subway attacked Arthur first. Did he commit a crime or was there some other reason? But luckily, he read the script and talked with Todd about the movie. I saw Brett Cullen in this movie as Thomas Wayne and as a character in Dark knight rises. **It's like Ask Science, but all questions and answers are written with answers gleaned from the universe itself. We explain what was really happening and what it means. If Arthur was a killer and incredibly dangerous, would he just be sitting opposite his counselor, even if in handcuffs. Going to the police might only make things worse. He probably injured his foot or leg then. Arthur was wronged by Randall. This also reinforces the idea that he's a product of his environment - cold and dark.4.) Why did Arthur shut himself in the refrigerator? Additionally Wall Street is a metaphor or metonym for rich people. 2b) would be Batman starts even younger, similarly to how the show Gotham is running, with a 40-something Joker a realistic threat to a teenage Bruce. Edit, Enough to make a sequel, or at least the money. While some of what he does is understandable, Fleck ends up crossing line after line and, by the time the credits roll at the end, hes a very different man from what he started the blockbuster as. Could it be possible that Arthur didn't want Penny to be his mother? The Event's Origin Explained, We Still Haven't Seen Dune's Weirdest Creature, From Yoda To Huyang: The 10 Oldest Star Wars Characters. Edit: Sequel is confirmed. Metaphorically Gotham is presented to us as a cold place, in which whatever the character does he's punished for. We don't actually see Thomas doing anything wrong (other than being understanbly hostile towards a Arthur after the stunt he pulled on Bruce) that may suggest he is so amoral and corrupt that he would go into such illegal extents, instead of doing what real rich people do when they want to hide old shames (hire a "fixer" lawyer to quietly reach an economic agreement). Right from the start, the manner in which Arthur behaves and how he imagines himself are constantly and consistently at odds. Arthur's existence was barely registered by Sophie, his black single mother neighbour raising a daughter, and he ends up fantasising about her. Here, we see Arthur struggle with his rattling laughter, trying but failing to control it as it tears through him. This puts Arthur's birth year in 1948 or 1949, meaning that he was 32-33 years old during the events of the film. On the bus, Arthur was told off by a black woman to stop bothering her child. Essentially, audiences can watch the movie as director Todd Phillips' stab at making a movie about mental health. He is a mentally unstable failed comedian who, following his great lack of success and respect, loses his sanity until he becomes a nihilistic and psychotic criminal known as the . Edit, He was just doing his job. Murray became the "joke" and that joke was death. Or the studio is just waiting to use "THE" in the sequel. The scene at the very end, with Arthur locked up talking to the doctor/social worker - is it meant to be later, after he's been captured again, or is it a flashback to when he was hospitalised before, as was referenced earlier in the movie? Another possibility exists; the movie makes a point of establishing that the city's budget is practically nonexistent and funding for city services has been slashed to the bone. Python script that identifies the country code of a given IP address. Whenever Arthur trudges up the stairs, which are plenty, it is a physical representation of his struggle in life as Arthur. That's what it certainly appears to be? Knowing he cant trust a word his mother says, Joker decides to kill her. Edit, Yes, it is possible, but considering how things develop and are revealed through the film this all seems highly unlikely and if it were true, then it would give the viewing audience no clue. He gets at least one call by the police because they want to question him. 1 level 2 In other words: Who Arthur imagines himself to be, and how he eventually acts, finally comes together. Edit, No-one.Todd knew, that Joaquin is the perfect role for the Joker. Possibly the crowning moment is when he gets his first stand-up gig. Arthur Fleck becomes Joker - and goes on a rampage. How to combine several legends in one frame? It is further evidence he is likely to be on the spectrum. | When Arthur's boss fired him over the gun, how come Arthur didn't mention Randall giving the gun to him because he was told to have it for self-defense? Some post-screening stuff to think about. The police are pretty sure that Arthur did it, but they don't have confirming evidence yet, and don't want to be made fools because they caught a patsy. Who plays Batman, the other side of the coin, and why isn't he credited? Arthur was making up at the dresser when he heard someone at the door, and he instinctively took with him a pair of scissors. It took a series of events to trigger Joker's genesis. "Joker" centers around the iconic arch-nemesis and is an original, standalone story not seen before on the big screen. And was it Arkham State Hospital. But maybe, if she lived, Sophie called the police about Arthur, which could be another reason why Detectives Garrity (Bill Camp) and Burke (Shea Whigham) returned to Arthur's apartment building to talk to him again. Was Sophie actually a real person, or was she just all just in Arthur's head to begin with? The character feels like he can no longer breathe, which is reinforced his consistent laughing which often appears to choke him.3.) Isolated, bullied and disregarded by society, Fleck begins a slow descent into madness as he transforms into the criminal mastermind known as the Joker.Fair use.\"Copyright Disclaimer Under Section 107 of the Copyright Act 1976, allowance is made for \"fair use\" for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. Edit, Yes, he smokes the American Spirit brand. He clearly was mocking him. The scene has led to debates over whether or not the entire film is Arthur's fantasy. Cookie Notice Others have been quick to point out that he'd have been unable to get out once he climbed inside, so it's certainly plausible. Edit, The film is geared to provide a more sympathetic look into who the Joker is and less towards who Thomas Wayne is, the opposite that is normally done regarding Batman's history. Joker Ending Explained: What REALLY Happened To Arthur - Screen Rant Why is Joaquin Phoenix's version of Joker wearing a red suit doesn't Joker always wear purple? Edit, When Arthur gets his mother's records from the hospital, where it can be seen that she was involuntarily admitted at the age of 25 on November 2, 1952. The debate over Zazie Beetz's fate in "Joker" came to an end last month when cinematographer Lawrence Sher said her character, Sophie, was not killed by Joaquin Phoenix's Arthur. 'Joker' spoilers! These 5 scenes will disturb you so much - USA Today Failed comedian turned anarchist murderer, mob boss using the insanity plea, a pure force of chaos and evil- Gotham's dark side personified. Using the gun acquired from Randall, Arthur kills the first two men in self-defense. Who is never mean to Arthur and is treated rather mean by by everybody (even (maybe unintentionally) Arthur). Trivia If Penny abused Arthur and was confined to Arkham, why was Arthur living with her for most of the film, wouldn't he have been separated from her by the state? Randall was so brilliantly evil that Rolling Stone ranked him 31st in the "40 Greatest TV Villains of All Time" list. We would like to show you a description here but the site won't allow us. Those scenes where Arthur was with his "girlfriend" or up on stage doing stand-up and getting cheered, he walks, talks and reacts in almost "normal" ways. Was Thomas Wayne meant to be a character who is "rude" like Arthur Fleck says? | Even then Randall takes advantage of the good nature of Arthur by talking him into taking the gun. Edit, Clowns are silly and Wayne though the people were silly. The supremely dark new movie "Joker" is the type of flick that offers itself up to many interpretations - both positive and negative. Arthur all. Joker was a very diligent son who took care of his mother, regularly mailing her letters and bathing her. This is where we go from feeling sorry for him to seeing him as the psychopath he is. Randall is shown to be so concerned for Arthur's well-being after he gets beaten that he gives him the firearm to defend himself. Well, one thing we can agree on at least is just how every it is when Joaquin Phoenix gives his final laugh of the movie. Edit, He certainly could, but: Can the game be left in an invalid state if all state-based actions are replaced? This means that no one really knows where he came from and this gives an aura of mystery to the character. "Not all people are awful." Arthur is next seen exiting Sophie's apartment but it's never made clear whether he murdered Sophie or not. I tensed up. Comments Fincher made shows that he did not like the film, criticizing it as another Hollywood franchise film that steals from more original films, namely Taxi Driver and the King of Comedy. Did Arthur/Joker kill the mental hospital clerk who refused to give him the papers regarding his mother?
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